Posted by Rachel on: 06.29.2007 /
The group Evangelicals for Human Rights recently released An Evangelical Declaration Against Torture: Protecting Human Rights In An Age of Terror. Here are a few excerpts:
Even when a person has done wrong, poses a threat, or has information necessary to prevent a terrorist attack, he or she is still a human being made in the image of God, still a person of immeasurable worth…A person might do inhuman acts, but is never inhuman…
It is clear to us that the terrorist attacks that jolted the nation in 2001 have blurred our nation moral vision…The boundaries of what is legally and morally permissible in war have been crossed in the current “war on terror”…
We renounce the use of torture and cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment by any branch of our government (or any other government)…We call for the extension of basic human rights and procedural protections to all persons held in United States custody now or in the future, wherever and by whomever they are held.
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Comment by: joe
1 06/29/07 5:13 AM | Comment Link |To answer the points:
1. The points are absolutely correct, and I cannot see how anyone can argue against them.
2. Nope.
3. I’m not sure a nation can be said to have a morality as such, given that it consists of a large group of individuals. Those in power in the USA appear to be travelling on a course whereby they get whatever they like, even if it means trashing the constitution and civil liberties.
That said, I think such statements are largely futile. Comparing it to the actions of people such as these I’d say it whilst worthy, it is rather pointless.
Comment by: Elaine
2 06/30/07 3:56 PM | Comment Link |I am in agreement with the statements in this quote.
Nor do I think there is ever any circumstance that will justify torturing another living being - human or animal.
Yes, I think we have lost our way (if we ever knew it) - certainly it seems to be declining - to use someone else’s bad behavior to excuse our own makes us no more ethical or moral than those that we condemn. (it is like listening to 2 children saying - he started it, so it is his fault.)
How can we not look at past history and not realize the long term ramifications to ourselves and future generations if we continue this pattern? We have to find a different way to respond to violence.
Comment by: benjamin ady
3 06/30/07 4:46 PM | Comment Link |Aren’t Christians supposed to believe that somehow or at some level, the torture of Jesus was justified, necessary, ultimately … good (that is to say that his torture, while horrible and ugly and bad, was both necessary and ultimately led to good ends)? (Just asking)
Comment by: benjamin ady
4 06/30/07 4:53 PM | Comment Link |Joe
Thankyou for the link. A fascinating story. I want to be more like these priests
Comment by: David H
5 06/30/07 6:56 PM | Comment Link |While the torture of Jesus led to good ends that doesn’t make it good. Paul tells us all things work together for good, but he doesn’t tell us that all things are good. More importantly, the torture of Jesus was not justified. If I slap you because I deserve to be slapped, that doesn’t make my slap justified. There are big questions about whether the torture and death of Jesus were necessary (what if all people had proclaimed him king and accepted his kingdom). But they certainly seem inevitable. But inevitable neither makes them good or justified. It just makes them unavoidable.
It is never futile to speak the truth. Silence in the face of a lie tells the liar that you accept the lie. Christians must speak out against things such as torture because to do otherwise is to a) tacitly condone those actions and b) provide no counterpoint to those claiming to speak for Jesus who say it is acceptable in the eyes of God.
However, even if good Christians speak out against war and torture, that won’t necessarily stop them. I have big questions about whether a civil institution (a government) can follow the precepts of Jesus and survive. But for the believer the question should be: what is more important, the government or the precepts of Jesus? I have made my decision so I have to say (not just believe) that torture is not right, I don’t support it and my desire is for our government to stop. I have to say that even if it doesn’t stop the torture.
Too often Christians use the likely outcome as an excuse to do nothing. I can’t fix (save) the world, therefore I shouldn’t try. But if Jesus made one thing clear, it isn’t all about the outcomes. The outcomes are in the hands of God. What we as the followers of Jesus are asked to do is act.
Comment by: joe
6 07/1/07 2:32 PM | Comment Link |Gandhi once said “Whatever you do will be insignificant, but it is very important that you do it.”
I agree with this. My point with reference to the above statement is that as christians we have too often taken the soft option of making grand sounding statements, rather than the hard road which leads to arrest and imprisonment.
Of course, there are different occasions where different ways of protesting are appropriate. It saddens me, however, how often we write letters, reports and petitions and how few of us are prepared to break the law and take the consequences on matters of conscience.
Comment by: Elaine
7 07/1/07 3:28 PM | Comment Link |Benjamin - I’ve been thinking about your question about the torture of Jesus since I read it yesterday.
Here is what my perception and belief as a Christian is.
1. I never thought it was good that Jesus was tortured and died on the cross. Jesus chose to accept the torture - he knew what was coming AND he chose to go through this - for me and you, and you…(did the soldiers, the women & children, et al choose it?)
2. The ultimate model of how to respond to violence - a different way - He chose not to respond to violence with violence - but with love - he would not allow the disciples to harm the soldiers who came for him in the garden
3. This is the model I am to follow - love my enemies - return good for evil
The old testament has a lot of violence - but Jesus came to put an end to that - to model a new way for his followers and the world.
Sitting here now, thinking that someone loved me enough to be tortured and die for me - overwhelms me.
Could I do that for another?
I have to add my voice, vote, actions to those who oppose violence where ever it is found…
I agree with the Gandhi statement Joe provided. I have to do that insignificant thing - what is my part in contributing to peace and justice today?
Comment by: Justice and Compassion
8 07/2/07 2:04 AM | Comment Link |[...] the A Declaration Against Torture thread, Joe shared this quote from Gandhi: “Whatever you do will be insignificant, but it is very [...]